Knowing Who Your Customer Is

[00:00:00] Ted McElroy: Hello, Catherine. Hello, Ted. How are you? I was wondering how this was going to work. I didn’t know if y’all were going to both be in the same room at the same time, or if y’all were going to be separate computers or whatever. So this is exciting for me. Yeah, well, we debated, cause I wasn’t shy that microphone was going to sound if we’re both trying to just use a computer.

 

[00:00:19] So, so hopefully there’s not too much echo or whatever. Oh no, y’all sound great. Hey Daryl. Hey, fantastic. So this is a, this is a twofer for me. As far as first I’ve got, well, actually multiples it’s I’ve got, um, two people on and I’m interviewing at the same time. Uh, two people who are y’all in the same room, same building.

 

[00:00:43] Well, apart from each other. Okay. All right. And then of course, this is my first international podcast international. That’s cool. How’s it going? Well, you guys, I mean, I haven’t seen y’all in the flesh in almost a [00:01:00] year now. I know. Right. It’s just been kind of a wild, wild ride for the last year and a half.

 

[00:01:08] Um, I don’t know where we’re hanging in there. It’s been kind of hard on, on our team a bit hard on the, um, some of the business side of it, but we’re going into flu season. So that’ll boost our revenues a little bit and then we’ll have to see how it goes from there. Um, I know I’m tired. Like I it’s, I think I was talking with my, with my coach, you know, Renee.

 

[00:01:32] Um, and she said, yeah, I think it’s called compassion, fatigue. And I suggest, I think on there. Yeah. That’s um, you’re the second person that’s talked about that. And to me on this podcast in the last three weeks, the same thing was talked about by Amy Bogue. I definitely know it’s decision fatigue, if nothing else.

 

[00:01:51] Um, cause our decision-making that we’re having to do is way higher than I’ve ever had to do in my life before this. And by the minute it [00:02:00] seems, or it feels like, oh yeah, yeah, everything’s got to be faster. And right now, and I’ve got to have my answers right away and that kind of thing. So it’s, it is crazy.

 

[00:02:08] I think 10 of the, of the intensive. Did you find it useful? Do you get, take away quite a bit or did, and I didn’t, I guess it’s because I’ve dug into it a lot already with the. You know, and, um, the, uh, and I’m, I’m going to wait and tell y’all some of what we’re talking about is going to get used at the, in the actual thing.

 

[00:02:28] I’ll sorta cut and splice and whatever, but this may be one of those things. Um, that’s the book that I’m discussing for everybody who’s not familiar with. This is called the vision of a vision driven leader is my Michael Hyatt. And Michael is our group coach that we have for our wonderful group seven, the best group that they ever had by the way.

 

[00:02:48] And I actually, I think will also be the last group that he coaches that I don’t know if that’s a good thing for him or bad thing for him to go out on a bang with us. But anyway, um, so I dug in. [00:03:00] From reading the book and then work through the process because my coach had recommended that I do that. So it was kind of repeat a little bit, but at the same time, I, I think I dug into it a little differently.

 

[00:03:15] I forced myself to look at it a little differently when I found out this is what we were going to be doing. And I think that was helpful. So I’ve spent the majority of my day today, typing out some of that stuff and fixing my actual vision script that I had before to try and sort of update it. So what’d you guys think I found it really quite helpful, not even so much the visions script work, but the, the cascading down of the information, the way that they’ve sort of they’ve set it up.

 

[00:03:50] Um, I’d heard them talk about the. Team alignment piece before that wasn’t really a surprise, but just getting a feel for how [00:04:00] they, they make it kind of a rolling, you know, constantly evolving kind of a planning process, which is not something I been really familiar with. I was more familiar with the Senate and then work from that plan kind of a thing.

 

[00:04:14] But obviously in this day and age, that doesn’t work very well anymore. Right, right. Yeah. Like a three years thinking you’re thinking on a three-year cycle kind of thing and then redo it in three years. Yeah. Kind of thing. I, I don’t mean coming from that sports background, curling, it was a quadrennial or the Olympic every four years the Olympics.

 

[00:04:33] So that’s kind of how I thought about a vision. Also vision script also is like, cause you said at the beginning of your beginning of your four years, you figure out what you guys are going to do. And then every four years it resets. Right. But you know, so many gave you a little bit of. I had start having that background that you have for me, you know, everything is set on the calendar and not thinking that far [00:05:00] ahead up until a few years ago, when I got involved with some roles within an organization I’m in called vision source and the companies that we were working with, they’re all thinking 10 years down the road.

 

[00:05:12] They’re not thinking even five or, you know, they’re thinking of way, way ahead and listening to them makes you start thinking things a little differently in your own business. So that was, that was helpful. But I still don’t think I really put myself into the place of truly planning that three years ahead.

 

[00:05:30] It was still set on that. Well, here’s the end of this year, how are we gonna do for next year? And that sort of thing. So it, it really was helpful having that type of, of, uh, exposure to things. Yeah, we sort of went a little further when we first bought the business, um, six years ago now, cause we kinda had a ten-year plan in place.

 

[00:05:48] Um, mainly for, um, what we’re going to do at the end of 10 years. When we go to sell the business, what are we going to continue working? Um, Catherine’s still going to be a pharmacist in the business. She’s [00:06:00] going to fall into a business management type role or what are we going to do? So we kind of had some of that in place.

 

[00:06:06] Um, and it’s, it continuously evolves because of the planning that we have done. A lot of it’s fallen through with, um, finding a pharmacist to, um, purchase the business at the end of our 10 years, what we thought would be our 10 years. So that continuously evolves. Yeah, well, before we get to deeper into anything else and I have to cut and splice a lot, I’m going to get us started.

 

[00:06:32] Um, so if y’all just bear with me while I do my little dog and pony show here at the very beginning, and then we’ll, uh, we’ll get going into us.

 

[00:06:48] welcome to the vision of leadership podcast. I’m your host, Ted McEvoy. This podcast is dedicated to helping you find your wins, have a better quality of life and become the best leader you can be. Hey, have you [00:07:00] subscribed to this podcast yet? Don’t miss an episode. They’re worth every single thing you paid for them, which is nothing because they’re free.

 

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[00:07:48] on episode 102 of this podcast, Chris interviewed Justin Kwan, Michelle Andrews, and Richard Ruth. They pointed out that as a profession, we have done a great job of letting our patients know that myopia is not a big deal. [00:08:00] If you can see 2020, there is no worry. It is the high myopes that are. And as they said, that message is tragic.

 

[00:08:09] Any myopia has a higher risk of maculopathy glaucoma and earlier cataract development in the, my site one day clinical trials, only 4% of study participants who got pro clear one days stayed stable in their myopia progression over the three-year period. That means you can confidently say parent, by not going to a system gear to slow the myopia progression. knowing who your customer is.

 

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[00:08:56] Contact your CooperVision representative to find out more about [00:09:00] my site. One day contact. Welcome to the vision of leadership podcast. I am really excited today. This is a multiple multiple first for me. Uh, first of all, I am, I’ve got two very good friends of mine. It’s not my first time having friends, but, uh, two friends that are international, uh, Catherine McCann and Darryl hunt.

 

[00:09:19] They are from Canada and, uh, from coma, isn’t a pronounced that correctly hallmarks. Okay. I never could. I apologize, uh, which is in British. Very close to Vancouver in that area. Um, and they also are a husband and wife team. So I’m actually, uh, interviewing two people at the same time and they’re in the same building, but not on the same computer.

 

[00:09:44] So this is kind of weird for me. Uh, Catherine is a pharmacist at a medicine shop, uh, franchise there in Canada. We have medicine shop franchises here in the U S as well. In fact, uh, we were using the one here in Tifton for quite some time before they, [00:10:00] uh, closed up and moved out. Darryl now is running the business side of things more often.

 

[00:10:06] He also went and got his masters in business, I believe about a year ago. Is that right? Daryl? Not quite. I have one more course to do. And then, uh, yeah, I was, I was conferring the degree upon you before you’re ready to get it. So I apologize. I don’t to, I don’t want to steal any of your time away, but anyway, welcome to the podcast guys.

 

[00:10:23] I’m really happy to have both of you here today. Thank you. Certainly. So, uh, we were digging into some things a little bit already, and one of the things I did want to sort of circle back to is how common is a private pharmacy in Canada, because all of us in the U S we keep thinking, you know, pretty much healthcare is all socialized.

 

[00:10:49] They’re unsure. It’s not nearly as much as we think it is, but what is it like to have a private pharmacy, a private business, and a healthcare realm and, uh, in a foreign government for [00:11:00] us? Well, I think there is a lot of misinformation about what public health care is in Canada. I like to say to people, what we have is our hospitals and our doctors are paid for pretty much everything else.

 

[00:11:14] We have private insurance for, or we have to pay for out of pocket. So in our pharmacy, we have a, basically a private. I private funded a business that we run and we do get some payment from governments and a lot for private plan insurance. So similar, I think to what happens in the United States with the various insurance plans, we adjudicate the prescriptions through these various plans, including the government plan for things like income supplements and social assistance and disability.

 

[00:11:50] But we really are a private business and it terms of private, uh, solo ownership in pharmacies. We’re becoming a bit of a rare breed [00:12:00] where there’s quite a few corporates in Canada now that tend to buy up the smaller pharmacies. Whereas even 30 years ago, when I started practicing pharmacy, it was much more independently owned a small pharmacies in your local neighborhood.

 

[00:12:16] And that’s very similar to here and also with optometry here in the states as well. Um, you know, when we first moved to Tifton, there were, they had like actually a local pharmacy association. There were about 12 or 13 pharmacists every year for Christmas, I’d get a box of chocolate covered pecans. And, you know, I would enjoy that. knowing who your customer is.

 

[00:12:34] And slowly that list gets smaller and smaller and smaller, and the tin stopped arriving. And now I believe here in Tifton, we’ve got maybe, I don’t know, three independent pharmacies, everything else is either CVS, Walgreens, or Walmart, you know, pretty much everything else is very, very little private pharmacy here.

 

[00:12:54] Uh, we still do use personally, I use. Private pharmacy here in town for me. Um, [00:13:00] moons, give them a big plug. Not that they’re, you know, I don’t know if they’re listening, but Hey, if they are, Hey, that’s great. But it’s really nice having that local connection and why it’s so important, especially in a small town is, I mean, I see these people all the time and it’s an important thing for me to want to invest in my own community, to do business in my own community, especially in a time right now, where everybody is doing things so easily somewhere else.

 

[00:13:25] And, um, I would presume that even though your, your pharmacy is a franchise, it’s still you’re running it yourself. Yeah, absolutely. We are very independent in being able to make our own decisions. And one of the decisions that we’ve made in terms of promoting ourselves in the community, especially because we’ve got other competitors fairly close to us, uh, and also the community itself has a number of pharmacies in it.

 

[00:13:56] We’ve elected to really focus on our community, um, [00:14:00] giving back to the community, being. You know, we talk about us living and working in this community and not being some big nameless, you know, big box store that happens to have a pharmacy in it. We spend a lot of time getting to know the people that come in the door.

 

[00:14:14] We know them by name many of them, and it’s that small town feel we’ve still tried to capture in our store. And I think that differentiates us from the big corporations that are out there. The nice thing about the medicine shop banner franchise, if you like is that we still get some of the buying power in order to bring in our medications and our front store items, uh, you know, with, with that buying group, if you like.

 

[00:14:41] Uh, and also we get a lot of help with the advertising on a national level, through their marketing programs that we, we pay into through our franchise. So basically it’s just giving you a support system. That’s helping you do your business and making it easier. So you’re not having to [00:15:00] reinvent every single thing, but you’re having to come up with a lot of it still on your own.

 

[00:15:04] And I think that’s really helpful having a team approach with the two of you working at this from both sides of it. Yeah, it’d be, it’d be a lot of work on our, on your own. And, um, when we are our business partner who is in Edmonton, she’s been on her own and this is her third franchise. Um, her first one, she started up up by herself, independent small little pharmacy, about 400 square feet.

 

[00:15:28] And she had to figure it out all by herself kind of thing. Um, but having her in the medicine shop, um, franchise or behind us, um, give us a little bit support in that, that marketing. Um, they, they give us the purchasing power, so they, they go out and store. And have a, a formulary or a schedule drugs that they follow.

 

[00:15:49] Um, they go out and purchase them from the big McKesson, and then we can purchase them at a lower rate than what you would just by going McKesson directly. Right. So giving you some [00:16:00] economy of scale. So you’re able to do some things a little bit more affordably, but I’m sure not only does it help your margins, but I’m sure it also helps you pass a lot of that on to your own customers as well.

 

[00:16:11] Absolutely. It helps keep us competitive. Yeah. I think sometimes people are surprised when they come to us and they find out that our, our prices for our medications are actually pretty reasonable where we’re not the most expensive in town, so to speak. So that’s, that really helps us as well. And we do have some folks that are price conscious, uh, for a reason or mainly seniors is who we, we serve in our community.

 

[00:16:38] We’re a time we’re a retirement community. And so some of them are in fixed income. And so they pay attention to that and we try and make sure that we can meet their needs without breaking their bank. And with that, you know, I’m presuming also, you’re always looking for different revenue streams, different income [00:17:00] producers, not just the pharmaceuticals.

 

[00:17:02] What are some things that you’ve brought into your business in the last couple of years? That are maybe different from what you would ever expected you would have done 10 years ago? One of the things is actually when we purchased the store, um, the previous owner had developed a large, um, home health care area in the store, like for walkers, wheelchairs, um, braces, like for like, um, wrist braces, ankle bracelets, something like that.

 

[00:17:28] So we’ve been developing that side of the store, um, quite a bit in order to maintain our, um, our level of profitability in the business. Um, we also have introduced a couple of new products. One of them being, uh, Katherine can speak more to this, but it’s a DNA, um, DNA service that will determine whether or not how you, um, process medications based on your genetic makeup.

 

[00:17:59] [00:18:00] So talk about that, Catherine. So, yeah, we brought in these kits a few years ago. They are the company that we use is called my DNA. Uh, the company originates out of Sydney, Australia, actually, and the medical director of this particular laboratory that processes, the kids is someone who has a lot of experience and background in, uh, pharmacogenetics or the study of medication being affected by.

 

[00:18:31] So, what we’ve done is where we bring these kits in and we offer them to people who have been struggling with either side effects or ineffective medication and with a panel of specific medications, we can test them and see if maybe their genetics is impacting the results they’re getting from their medications.

 

[00:18:52] So what it does is it looks at things like the metabolism of the medication, uh, as well as some of the distributors. Yes, she’s at [00:19:00] arise with the medication. So how well you can, um, either absorb the medication or eliminate the medication. So it’s a nice tool to have in the tool chest, so to speak. So I use it selectively.

 

[00:19:14] I use it when I have people that seem to have to go through a number of different medications and still are struggling to get any impact or results from their medications and for the ones that we’ve been using it with. They’ve had some very interesting results. Obviously our genetics are we’re all individuals.

 

[00:19:32] Sorry. Vary from person to person. And so the results that we get are always different. And when we go through and do some interpretation and make some recommendations based on those results, it’s really quite fascinating. And we’ve had, uh, we’ve had a number of people that have benefited from that we’ve known which medications to stay away from and which ones that we might maybe need to bump up the doses a little bit in order for them to get an effective, uh, result from.[00:20:00] 

 

[00:20:00] And, uh, it’s something that we definitely get a lot of interest in when we bring it up when we do our consultations with patients. So what are there certain disease processes that it seems to work a lot better for than others? Or is this pretty much a panacea for every kind of health condition that there is?

 

[00:20:17] Uh, no, there are a couple of specific ones that we use it in. I use it in, particularly with people suffering from depression also, um, from cholesterol anemia or high cholesterol. And I also will use it occasionally, uh, with some of my heart disease patients. Uh, especially if they’re having a lot of side effects from the standard medications that they use after heart attacks, for example, uh Metaprolol or is there, those are beta blockers that slow the heart rate and people have sometimes get a lot of side effects from those.

 

[00:20:53] So I sometimes use the DNA testing to, to figure out if those medications or [00:21:00] if they’re their genes are the culprit, or if we just maybe need some dose adjustments or to avoid the medication altogether. So I’ve used it in a couple of targeted areas. The other area that it does work for is an anticoagulation with medications like warfarin, but I find that on a practical level that, um, you’re starting.

 

[00:21:23] People usually fairly quickly for, uh, as a result of a diagnosis. And so trying to wait for the genetic results to come back. It’s not very practical approach to that. So are you compounding these, these, uh, medications yourselves? Are you sending them out? You’re actually, once you get the testing, you send it off to this group in Australia and they send you the meds back.

 

[00:21:46] Is that how it’s working? You know, they actually have a testing lab here in Canada. Uh, but the, what happens is we bring the patient in. We described what the test is. We describe what it doesn’t do. [00:22:00] For example, it won’t test for diseases. It won’t test for your genealogy, for example. Uh, but we will, we do a little throat at a, sorry, not through a cheek swab with a swab.

 

[00:22:10] We gather some cheek cells and we put it into a test tube and off it goes to, uh, um, the lab for testing. And then in about 10. Two 15 business days, we get the results back and by, um, through a portal that we use and that the patient can also sign into and we get all of the results and it, it comes back with about a 15 to 20 page report.

 

[00:22:33] So it’s quite comprehensive. And they also list every reference that they have used to, uh, substantiate the recommendations that they’re providing as well as giving us some information, to make our own clinical choices and judgment with. So we sorta got started off at the very beginning, talking about this intensive that we were doing.

 

[00:22:57] Um, how much of, what you’re doing [00:23:00] in your business now has been directly related to the coaching that you’ve gotten over the last two years. Pretty much nothing yet

 

[00:23:18] when Michael hears that he’ll like, what? No, no. Um, for me it’s been, it’s been a really big, um, help in prioritizing my time that, that that’s been the absolute biggest help is, um, your, your day planner is, uh, do that every day. Keep that up to date to, you know, do your weekly big three and your weekly big three done.

 

[00:23:45] And it just snowballs. And you end up getting to that big goals that you had set up at the beginning of the quarter, at the beginning of the year. Um, that that’s the biggest thing I’ve gotten out of the business accelerator program. What’d you Catherine? [00:24:00] Well, for me, I think it’s been about. The community, you know, meeting people like yourself, for example, tab, that’s really been helpful and understanding that we’re not really alone at what we do here.

 

[00:24:16] There’s, there’s often a time when it feels very lonely. Uh, even though we have each other, but we get a bit instiller too. So it’s helpful to have, you know, the ability to bounce questions off. The people in the business accelerator group. It’s nice to have that context as well, in terms of other ideas, because sometimes you’ll hear an idea or someone will ask a question and there’ll be a, a group response to it, or we’ll get a response from some of the coaches in the program.

 

[00:24:49] And I’m, and then even when I hear the question, I’m like, well, I don’t know if that’s going to really apply to me, but after I hear the answer, I’m like, oh, I think I know where I can use that information to make my business better. [00:25:00] And I think that’s, what’s really been helpful for me personally. I think the other is just the idea.

 

[00:25:07] Um, I’m one of those, those people that ended up doing a whole lot of things all by myself, not feeling a lot, quite confident about delegation or being able to even share. The whole idea of where I want the business to go, which is what the vision script is supposed to be the tool for you to use for that.

 

[00:25:27] So having that direction and having the very simple step-by-step approach to building these tools that we’ve been using in our business has been very rewarding and very valuable Tufts. And I think that’s really helped us get crystal clear on what we want to do, um, even beyond what the franchise would have suggested for us to do.

 

[00:25:50] And that I think has been worth the time and energy and the money that we put into the program. Yeah. I agree with you guys on [00:26:00] all that. It’s, it’s kind of funny too. Some of the things, when someone will say something in a way that has nothing to do with the problem you’re working through in your head, but just for some reason, somehow they say it and it completely changes your, your perspective of what that challenge you’ve been working on has been, and you take it in a completely different direction.

 

[00:26:22] Um, are you guys doing any of the mastermind meetings as well? Uh, for those that aren’t familiar with, the mastermind, it’s a group where you have about five or six people together and you spend some time talking through a challenge you’re working on and everybody’s sort of speaks into it. Now, you guys do anything like that at all?

 

[00:26:39] Yeah, we, we have been, um, I, I it’s been helpful, um, just to be able to bounce ideas off of like Catholics to someone else other than her. Um, and also because of they, all the people in the mastermind group are all. Um, either small business or [00:27:00] of same familiar or same size businesses. What we have, some of them are actually husband and wife, couples that are in the group with me, the one.

 

[00:27:08] So it’s easy. It’s, it’s good to bounce off ideas off of them and see what they responded or how they handle the situation in the past or how they think they might handle that. So the mastermind group has been helpful to say the least. Yeah. So roll that the way back machine a little bit here. You’re at Catherine, you’re getting ready to start this pharmacy business of yours, Darrell.

 

[00:27:35] Uh, how did you get involved in the level that you got involved with? Um, where, where did you come into the mix and what decision did you have to make? What kind of changes you have to make and what you were doing prior to this, to, to join the organism. So myself, I’m actually an electronics technologist, and I’ve worked for the local, um, internet [00:28:00] provider, Shaw cable up here, internet TV provider, um, for the last, I guess it’s about eight years, seven years prior to this.

 

[00:28:07] Um, but I’ve always worked in electronics industry for, I don’t know, 20 years. Um, I’ve been the manager of one of the business department that I worked at at a previous company and enjoyed that side of the business operations. And when we moved out here to the coast, I thought I’d just continue down that path.

 

[00:28:30] Cause I was still with, uh, shock cable at the time. And when we decided to buy the store, we thought there’s no way that Catherine could do it on her own. And without paying out an exorbitant amount down like a manager or store manager or business manager continue with her, um, I thought I could at least minimum a minimal I could do like some of the bookkeeping, I’m a bit familiar with that a lot more now than it was back then.

 

[00:28:58] Um, human resources [00:29:00] and marketing, and I used to do a lot of marketing and at previous jobs. So I thought I’d take on that role. Um, just in the essence to save money in the business, to get it continually going at the beginning to keep us going at the beginning of the, of the adventure there. So that’s kinda how I got into the business.

 

[00:29:21] So then you, Catherine had worked, what were the next steps for you guys? Well, when we made the decision to, to perhaps look at buying or a pharmacy at that time, I was working as a hospital pharmacist. I’d had experience with community I’ve done, uh, quite a, a lot of variety of things in the pharmacy world.

 

[00:29:45] So when we made that decision, we approached our now business partner about the medicine shop franchise cause she had the two stores and she and I, and we indicated that we had one that we thought was for sale here in [00:30:00] Comox. And. She didn’t even miss a beat. She said, I would love to be a partner with you in that business if you’d like.

 

[00:30:06] So if it felt like we had the backup with all of her experience, um, the two of us, we felt pretty confident going into an established business. So we knew what the revenues stream was like. And the profitability was like, I think the things that were a bit of an unknown for us when we took it on was how were we going to sustain that without the previous owner’s involvement, he was quite clear that this was a retirement move for him.

 

[00:30:31] He wasn’t going to stay in the. And the other problem that we sort of foresaw was when we did an assessment at the team that we had knowing a little bit about the direction we wanted to go in with the business. We had some concerns that that team probably wasn’t going to help us get there and how we were going to have to make some shifts, some people around the roles potentially, or maybe help them find other employment.

 

[00:30:57] So that was when [00:31:00] we first got started, there were a lot of moving parts and we put in an awful lot of hours in that first year, just to get the business to a place where we want it to be and maintain, or the stability of the revenue stream. Like I say, we were worried that we might lose people because of that personal relationship with the previous owner.

 

[00:31:19] Uh, and then since then it’s been about, uh, slowly evolving it to. The kind of business that we wanted to have, uh, really build on the success of the previous owner who did a lot of what we’re doing in our community, in the community. We built on that. And then also moving it from much less of a, you know, a fill a prescription filling service to a much more complete home like healthcare and home health care, as well as a very high clinical focus in our practice. knowing who your customer is.

 

[00:31:53] That’s something that people are not really as familiar with. And we’ve had to spend a lot of time marketing our services [00:32:00] to the community. And yet once they’ve experienced them, it makes for a very good ambassadors for our business. We have them sing our praises after we’ve really helped them. So when you’re, you’re changing the direction, how much.

 

[00:32:20] Retraining did you have to do with your customers? I presume you wanted to keep as many of the old ones that you had, how much retraining did you have to do with your customers to get them to understand that what you were doing was going to be a little different from what they were used to, but still having that same feel of, of what they’d had in the past.

 

[00:32:40] I think what was really hard and what we ended up doing with some trial and error was recognizing that not all of the people that we, uh, brought did that came with the business. We’re going to be candidates for this new. So we ended up having to, if you like [00:33:00] segment our customers a little bit and look at them, uh, in terms of who would most benefit from this service, who would it be most open to the service and then looking at some ways that we could introduce the, a more clinical focus to their care.

 

[00:33:18] And as we started to. Better at doing it as well. We’ve started to identify more people that we could benefit and it just kind of snowballed from there. So we tried to take baby steps in the beginning, uh, mainly because we were still trying to get our team in place and do a few other things in the business and trying to focus on doing a whole bunch of new things, felt a little bit overwhelming to begin with.

 

[00:33:44] And I think that we’ve also learned that, you know, for every no, or two or three nos that we get, we eventually will get one or two or three yeses. And we just have to be persistent in pursuing that approach. And once, like I [00:34:00] say, once they’ve experienced it and we get them on a regular schedule of, of reviews, a regular schedule of clinical contact.

 

[00:34:09] They really miss it. If I end up having, you know, a pharmacist on holidays for a period of time, or what have you, because we kind of get behind in some of that work. So it’s been an interesting evolution. And I think over time, we’ve also attracted the kinds of patients that really appreciate that kind of service as well.

 

[00:34:28] So let me get this straight. You guys decided that we’re going to be some people y’all just, weren’t going to take care of anymore. And I’m putting that sort of bluntly, but Darrell, when you decided that was going to be the case you guys were going to take, how did you come to that decision that they’re just not going to be our customers anymore?

 

[00:34:48] Well, we didn’t necessarily go that far. What we did is we, we, we, we, cherry picked a lot of the patients that would benefit the most from the new services and we focused on [00:35:00] them and, and their, um, their needs. The ones that, so what, what Katherine was talking about? Our clinical services, like, um, medication reviews.

 

[00:35:10] So we identified, um, through the government process of who is eligible to get a medication to you. And it would be covered for by PharmaCare or by the government. We identified a lot of those people. And then we started marketing and developing a, um, a strategy to attract more patients. It’s very similar to that. knowing who your customer is.

 

[00:35:36] Um, we created an avatar that would, that is our ideal patient. And then we started marketing directly toward, towards that avatar so that when page new patients do come through the door, we can identify them almost immediately that there’s a patient that we want to talk to those ones. That’s when we want to massage and.[00:36:00]  knowing who your customer is.

 

[00:36:00] Take care of, it’s not like would not taking care of the non perfect ideal patient. We are. We just not, we’re not spending a lot of time in massaging them into a long-term customer if at that point. So this is actually kind of perfect. I’m glad you’re explaining this because this is, this is exactly what I think a lot of us, it’s not just, I think a lot of your colleagues, a lot of my colleagues struggle with this very thing. knowing who your customer is.

 

[00:36:28] We’re all trying to be something to everybody. When in fact, if we were going to concentrate on the people who are truly that ideal avatar for us, we could give them a much better experience. All those people who don’t fit into what we want would not be the right exp not be getting the right experience.

 

[00:36:46] And they might actually be happier somewhere else. That’s exactly that that’s exactly at Ted. Um, they may go to like, like Catherine says, we, we aren’t the cheapest in town, so they may, may make, they may choose to go [00:37:00] to another pharmacy that all they need is a prescription. Every 90 days, they don’t need any clinical services.

 

[00:37:06] They don’t need to be explained what their medication is. They don’t need to get their flu shot or their potentially COVID shot at a pharmacy. Right. So they can w w we tend to market towards the people that do need them will appreciate and pay for that type of service. I think one of the things in our business had that we’ve recognized early on is that we have to, that we have to be able to look at, uh, keeping our costs really low in order to.

 

[00:37:44] Out of focus on creating the time for our clinicians to be able to spend with our, with our, uh, patients. And that’s made a big difference in the shift in my thinking as well is I have found that when I’m able [00:38:00] to, uh, you know, that the prescription filling fulfillment side of it is running really smoothly.

 

[00:38:07] I’m not having to troubleshoot those processes as frequently. And that frees up my time to spend more time with the seniors that we serve. And that’s made a big difference in terms of our. Attraction, um, of those, those particular patients and also our satisfaction. So myself and the other two pharmacists that, that, you know, were in our business with us are they, they are really, they really liked having that extra time.

 

[00:38:37] That you wouldn’t normally be able to get, if all you were focusing on was trying to push out prescriptions out the door. So we we’ve done another thing on the other side of that is we’ve really embraced technology and automation to do our, the whole prescription fulfillment side of it. We’ve been embraced information technology and, uh, automation [00:39:00] of our, our billing processes to really, uh, leverage time on that side, to do it as efficiently and as accurately as we possibly can.

 

[00:39:10] And then that allows the pharmacist. Then the time at the other end, when the prescription is already filled to take the patient aside and do all of the clinical services. On that side. So, uh, we’ve, I, it’s an interesting idea because when I went through business school and did my MBA 30 years ago, what I was taught is you could either be a quality leader or you could be a cost leader, but you really can’t do both.

 

[00:39:36] And I actually would beg to differ. I think we do a little bit of both and we do that by really, um, making sure our posts, like I say, our processes are really finely tuned, uh, and also providing top quality clinical services men, some of which people will actually pay for. When you’re actually [00:40:00] had that avatar figured out, you know, who’s going to value it before they even know they’re going to value it.

 

[00:40:05] So the discussion is I’m presuming a lot easier to have with them because you’ve already figured out how you’re going to pitch it, how you’re going to, um, you know, take care of them on the long run. What, what does that process sound like if I’m I’m the right person walking through the door? How, how are you going to give me the, give me the goods?

 

[00:40:26] Well, I know when I have someone that comes in for the first time is I ask them if we can spend a few minutes just getting to know each other a little bit. And what that does is help me understand where their needs might be. So I like to, because as you just mentioned, sometimes people don’t even know what they need.

 

[00:40:47] So by asking some questions, taking the time to really listen to their concerns, helping them, uh, look at even. Their medication regimen a little differently, [00:41:00] even helping them identify if they’ve got side effects. For example, it’s surprising to me sometimes just as an aside, how often people will put up with things that are, you can solve for them.

 

[00:41:13] You know? So, uh, especially seniors, they just, you know, I hear this all the time. Well, you know, I’m just old and that’s just the way it is. And there’s nothing that can be done about it. And my response is no, that’s absolutely not true. There’s a lot we can do about it. So let’s sit down, let’s go through your list of things that are bothering you and let’s figure out some ways to solve some of these problems for you and, and to meet their needs.

 

[00:41:37] The other group, interestingly enough, has not just the. You know, the patient that we see, we do a lot of work with caregivers and their families. So, uh, it was, uh, it was a nice add on if you like to, to where we were targeting in terms of our business. But what we’ve also found is that, you know, the, the families, sons, and [00:42:00] daughters of the people that we serve are now part of that, that care approach, if you like.

 

[00:42:06] And we do a lot of work with them as well to try and help them feel confident and also feel. Like they’re taking care of mom and dad and that they have somebody in their court because it can be a little bit bewildering, especially when things go off the rails as they sometimes do, when you’re, you have people in their senior and they have health issues.

 

[00:42:30] So all of a sudden, you know, mom’s landed in the hospital and she’s had a heart attack or she’s had a stroke and, and, you know, the kids are scrambling to figure out what they’re going to do for her, you know, once she’s discharged. So we’ve become part of that help team, if you like. And often people are quite surprised when they come in and see us.

 

[00:42:50] And we just, we just handle a lot of things for them. And the family comes back afterwards and say, I don’t know what we would’ve done without your guidance and your help. We [00:43:00] wouldn’t have even known where to start. And so that’s been an other sort of avatar that we’ve been starting to develop and serve as well.

 

[00:43:08] Uh, from the, our business perspective, uh, and also, you know, just serving those two groups has been really quite satisfying. Um, you know, just to give you an example, I just got flowers the other day from one of our, our patients. Uh, it just, just, uh, I thank you for some of the work we’d done in it. And it was, it’s kind of surprising often cause it’s like, well, that’s just the, that’s just, uh, an average day for us.

 

[00:43:33] Right. But they were so appreciative. So how did you guys come to the idea of coming up with this ideal guest in the first place taro? Well, when another small business group that I belong to, um, the, one of the guys in the group is a marketer and he Mo mainly does its own marketing. Um, he doesn’t do a lot of like, um, newspaper, radio ads.

 

[00:43:57] He does all digital marketing. [00:44:00] And what he said is once you, once you’ve created. An avatar in the digital world. It’s very easy to market to directly specifically to that person. Um, you go on to Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, they all have a profile. Every, every person on that program has a profile. So if you create your, your avatar is say, let’s say he’s a golfer in his sixties who likes to think big picture.

 

[00:44:30] Well, you identify all of those things and you market to that, those bins, interest groups on Facebook, Instagram, you hit them exactly where like it’s a hundred percent people that you should be attracting to your business. Um, we also tried using the, we use that same avatar for times when someone comes looking for donations.

 

[00:44:55] So you have a group that comes to you and says, look, we’re looking for money for this certain. [00:45:00] Fundraiser that we’re doing. I said, well, who do you serve? Like who who’s your interest group? And so they tell me, and I’m like, I’m sorry that doesn’t hit our avatar. I don’t, I don’t want to spend my money on sponsoring your group because it’s not going to hit my target audience.

 

[00:45:16] So once we’ve developed that avatar, it’s simple for a lot of stuff like marketing. There’s a couple of golf courses around town that they look for, like hang signs on their fences or, um, a whole sponsor, like what, what’s your average golfers age? And they say, well, and they’re in their sixties. I’m all.

 

[00:45:36] That’s perfect. What hole I want pull 18, please. And then it’s, it’s really simple. If they came up and said, oh, we’re like early thirties, summer that neighborhood, I’m sorry, I don’t even want to sponsor a year. Of course they might golf, but they’re in the wrong age group. Right. So it’s really simple to make advertising.

 

[00:45:55] Decisions based on that avatar, but yeah, Adam, one of the guys in the group, [00:46:00] he, he, he has a marketing, um, PR marketing company that he does this work with all of his clients. Um, that’s one of the very first things that he does is find out who you want to serve and let’s build your avatar, start attracting those people.

 

[00:46:18] That’s brilliant, you know, because, um, we’d spin our wheels and our money and our time talking to the wrong people half the time we’re in business, you know, there’s that old joke in marketing. We know, we know 50% of our marketing works. We just don’t know which half. Yeah, exactly. Um, yep. Go ahead, Catherine.

 

[00:46:38] I’m sorry. Well, I was just going to say that it has also. We’ve also been able to use that as a teaching tool for our team members as well. So when we explained to them the kind of person that we are best able to serve, and when those [00:47:00] people show up for a variety of other reasons, for example, when they go into our home health care area to get a brace or, um, or to pick out compression socks or whatever it is that they’re buying down there, our team members know right away, if they’re the ideal candidate for our services and the prescription side or in the clinical side, and we’ve given them some.

 

[00:47:25] Talking tips if you like, or scripts to use in order to talk to them about where they get their prescription services. And one of the, and a couple of the benefits that they would get by moving their business to us. And our team is getting very savvy about how to do that and very smooth about how to do that and bringing, uh, over people from other pharmacies when they hear about the extra services that we provide and the, and the personalized touch that we provide in our pharmacy.

 

[00:47:57] And some of them will say, yeah, [00:48:00] I’m willing to give it a try. And we, we transfer them over and they get to experience what I think is a really high level of care and attention that we provide in our pharmacy. How do you teach your team, this avatar? What it, what this avatar looks like? I mean, how do you go about that process?

 

[00:48:24] So we actually, that the best thing Adam said is give it a name, give her, or him a name. So our perfect avatar is surely that’s who our avatar is. And that’s all we have to do is look, there’s a surely walking through the door and they can identify it. They start to identify that surely is that senior, maybe 65 ish.

 

[00:48:47] It comes in with a list of prescriptions in her hand kind of thing. Um, she’s there to like Catherine does maybe pick up some Tylenol or pair of compression socks, um, as soon as we start having [00:49:00] that conversation. And so it’s just simple questions about, um, are you from the valley, do you live close to the store?

 

[00:49:09] Um, do you, uh, are you recently retired or what’d you do for living kind of thing? Which kind of keys off some of the things like, so you were a teacher, so you have a very good benefits plan or you were in the military. You also have very good benefits plan, right? So they’re not the ones that are worried about how costly their prescriptions are because of their good benefits plan.

 

[00:49:34] And they also, our staff also understand that we have to keep feeling that the, uh, the pipeline, right, the funnel, their, their sales funnel. So they, they, they kind of know who to identify. Um, simply because we’ve had that conversation we’ve we told them, like, we’ve talked to them about, um, the program. One of the programs that we use is critical conversations.

 

[00:49:57] So we go through the program and set up [00:50:00] scenarios where, um, a mock patient comes into the store and they’re paid patient they’re paid actor who comes into the store and it is asking about. Compression socks or how do I transfer a prescription here? And so we’ve coached the team on the great answers to give when that patient comes in.

 

[00:50:24] Um, and the more you do it, the more easy that conversation becomes. And it doesn’t seem like, um, anything out of the ordinary, but it takes practice. Yeah. So, Catherine, how did you know there were enough Shirley’s to go around for you guys to make this work? Well, one of the things that the medicine shop Canada franchise helped us with was producing a demographic report for our area and giving us some insight into that avatar, if you like, or at least the really broad [00:51:00] population that we, that we have here in, in our local area.

 

[00:51:04] So that was one thing we had. We had some, we had some facts to back up what we. Wanting to do. We also had, of course, when we bought the business, we had our own database. So we could look at the, the average age of the, the person that we were already serving. Uh, we could also look at their, the kinds of disease processes they were experiencing so that we could be savvy about how we might be able to help them, especially with chronic diseases.

 

[00:51:38] Um, so high blood pressure, uh, chronic obstructive pulmonary disorders, um, uh, cardiac disease, diabetes type two diabetes. You know, those are probably our top four, uh, chronic diseases that we see in our practice. And then we just became really good at, at [00:52:00] quitting. What we saw in the demographic information with what we saw in our own information, and also sort of triangulating that if you like with the desired goal of bringing in people that would really benefit or be appreciative of the clinical services, and then using that, that information was how we made our choices around how to develop that avatar.

 

[00:52:25] So we didn’t do it in a vacuum. Um, we did do some, some thinking about it and got some data to back that up originally. And now after five and a half years, a lot of what we, we saw, uh, is run pretty true to what were the groups of people we’re serving, right. So I love how this is gone. I don’t know if y’all felt this like at about maybe, probably 10.

 

[00:52:50] O’clock your time today. I must have been channeling. I couldn’t be further away from the two of you in, in north America than I think I possibly am, except for if I was in Florida right [00:53:00] now. But my fourth question is who is your ideal guest? How did you identify them and how do you reach them? And y’all did this without me even having to prompt you.

 

[00:53:09] That was pretty impressive. Thank you both for pulling that one off. We’ll see if you can guess what my next question is going to be. Probably not. Okay. So, um, so I do want to do, do something that’s a little bit different than something we’ve not ever talked about in our groups, but something I’m kind of struggling with a little bit of late, and that is, um, sort of, uh, really feeling like I’m, I’m kind of a fraud a little bit, you know, this, um, imposter syndrome, if you will.

 

[00:53:39] Um, do you guys ever deal with that or is that. Oh, I think that’s just human nature. I, you know, I don’t think a day goes by that. I don’t think, oh man, somebody has got to figure me out one of these days. Uh, but I think, I think whenever you’re [00:54:00] doing something a little bit risky or you’re stretching yourself a little bit, I think that shows up in lots of forms.

 

[00:54:07] Uh, I like to think of it as, you know, a bit of resistance to doing things that might be a little bit uncomfortable to do. And then I might say, oh, you know, maybe I’m not cut out to do this. You know, I’m an imposter, whatever it is. I try and view that as probably a signal that I’m doing something that’s worthwhile.

 

[00:54:29] And that my, my brain is just trying to put up a few obstacles to doing it. And I, I think if we weren’t doing stuff that was really important work. Uh, I don’t think we would have that feeling and I don’t think that it would be worth where it’s doing all right. So I look at it as, yeah. I feel it a lot, but on the other hand, if I wasn’t feeling it, I’d be a little bit worried that I’m not doing something that’s stretching me a [00:55:00] bit.

 

[00:55:00] Right. But you Daryl, that’s an interesting question. Um, um, I’m kind of sitting here thinking about what, what, what, what is it the imposter syndrome, but I can relate to curling. So, um, bit of my background was 15 years ago. I co curled competitively on the world curling tour now on a different couple of different teams.

 

[00:55:25] Um, All you’d have to do is go out against like the world champion. And they’d make, they’d tell you you’re in a posture when they kick your button, like forehands and you’re, you know, but it, it, when, when you go out there and you think about, oh, um, you know, I’m out there trying my best doing, doing it as the best we can, we can compete with these guys, but we’re really not there.

 

[00:55:51] Like, what are we doing in this league? Like what, why are we spending our time, spend our money, spending our weekends, spending all of our evenings at the curling club practicing [00:56:00] just to go out there and be taught, showing who you really are when you come up against teams like that. But like Catherine says, if you’re not out there trying and participating, um, trying to advance yourself, you’re you’re, you’re never going to get.

 

[00:56:17] You never going to change. And I think that that being, trying to think of yourself as a posture, as part of that change process is from becoming someone who you weren’t before and at, at the end, you wouldn’t be in a posture. You’d be the, you would be a, I guess, what’d you call it a reality or a part of the part of that part of the real person or personality you’re trying to become no longer a pur no longer an impostor or trying to be somebody you’d be are that somebody’s.

 

[00:56:51] Yeah, because I mean, I think that our, our society today is all this whole fake it till you make it kind of thing. And. When we actually start [00:57:00] applying ourselves when we start trying to push ourselves in the ag. I agree with you, Katherine. I think it’s part of that is the, the being out of that comfort zone, maybe not exactly into the, um, um, what’s the other zone we were talking about the other day, the delusional zone, you know, where you’re so far out in front of yourself, you know, that, I think that’s where you start getting into more narcissistic and then you’re definitely not feeling like a fraud.

 

[00:57:20] You’re just feeling like I’m, I’m Superman. I can do anything. But when you’re in this almost feeling like a fraud a little bit, like you said, Catherine, I think probably a better, somebody’s going to figure me out sooner or later. I don’t know when it’s going to happen, but somebody is going to finally look at me and goes , you know, you’re I got ya.

 

[00:57:36] You know? And um, I kind of have, I felt that, like that a lot more. It seems like in the last year, maybe it’s this compassion, fatigue, maybe it’s the decision fatigue. Maybe it’s just the fact that we’re all. Not quite out over the tips of our skis, but we’re getting pretty close to it, you know? And, um, it’s, uh, it’s a different feeling perhaps than it’s [00:58:00] been in the past.

 

[00:58:00] And I guess part of it is changing. You guys are doing the same thing. You’re changing the way you’re doing your business. You’re putting it into a different place. You’re going to actually probably have somebody else doing all the things that you’ve identified yourself as in the past, moving forward.

 

[00:58:18] And how does that feel now that you’re not having that identity anymore? Well, I think it feels a bit like you’re an anchored for sure. You know, I, I would be surprised if you spoke with anyone that’s been through the last 18 months, that doesn’t feel a bit like they’re at sea. Uh, especially if you’re in a healthcare field where, you know, you’re.

 

[00:58:48] It felt, at least to me, like I was doing battle on two fronts. If you like, you know, trying to keep my team from feeling too much anxiety about the situation, [00:59:00] plus trying to be the professional, if you like on the other side, the factual information to all the hysteria, especially in the very beginning when people didn’t really know what was going on.

 

[00:59:14] Uh, so I, I, I think that it’s, that’s part of how we grow. It’s part of how we get about a little bit better every day with what we do and. Yeah. I, you know, being an imposter sometimes I think is not a, it’s not really a bad thing. If you look at it from the perspective of, I would like to be so much better than where I am right now.

 

[00:59:38] And in order to do that, I need to identify what I need to do better and how I’m going to move towards that ideal state, if you like. And I like to look back occasionally and just remind myself about how far I’ve come or we’ve come in as a couple in our business and how far our business has come, just to remind [01:00:00] myself that.

 

[01:00:00] Yeah, I probably felt like that imposter when we started and yet we’re still doing a lot of things. Um, and we continue to maintain a good business in our community. We must be doing something right. And I think I have to hold on to that, uh, in order to move forward as well. So reminding myself, we gained a lot in the last number of years that we’ve been doing this and that experience is going to serve us well going forward.

 

[01:00:31] So one of the things to sort of get us on the end of this thing, we being in business accelerator, um, we’ve had to celebrate wins and I said, had to, because that’s not something that was typically part of my, part of my DNA, I guess you’d say, you know, it was all, you know, oh, great. We finished that now.

 

[01:00:50] What’s next. You know, that was the way I basically operated, but now we have to sit down and celebrate these wins. So each of you tell me one win that you’ve had for the last quarter. That [01:01:00] was pretty impressive for yourself.

 

[01:01:05] Well, I’ll tell you, after a year of, uh, working hard in our business through the COVID season, if you like, one of the wins I felt really strongly about was I went out and bought an e-bike and I started to ride that on a semi-regular basis. But just the idea that I had an opportunity to, you know, to be able to afford one of those, be able to, you know, look after my health in midst of all of this whirlwind that we found ourselves in.

 

[01:01:39] I thought it was a pretty significant win. Great. How about you Darrell? Well, one of the things that this last quarter, what we did is we changed all of our software in the store. Like everything, if it’s software, our POS software, instead of doing like one and then maybe do another one, but we did it all.

 

[01:01:58] Um, [01:02:00] and we’re, that was January was our first. Our first one and then March was our second one. So it’s kind of like, that was that, that quarter, that first quarter of the year we’ve got that all that done second quarter was kind of figuring out how to work it, how to use it right. And massage it all. And finally, this, this quarter, we’ve kinda got it all together.

 

[01:02:21] Um, our billing software is working really well. Um, the team has gotten used to the new dispensing software solving their own problems. They, uh, they, they don’t need to be, um, hampering Catherine or one of the other pharmacists all the time to, how do we do this again? How do you do that again? They’ve all developed that, um, we set aside time for training, um, for them to be able to figure out this stuff on their own and also go through some of the, um, The training manual that we developed or that the software provider developed, um, [01:03:00] so that we don’t have to be standing up there answering questions all day long.

 

[01:03:04] So I think this quarter has been really good in that we’ve moved ahead and, uh, the team is getting, uh, really, uh, efficient at the new, the use of the new software. So that was a good win for us. I didn’t even tag onto what Darryl said about the software in the sense that I wouldn’t have thought that just making a switch in the software would help us do our processes even better.

 

[01:03:32] I w what I was looking for was to fill some holes that my previous software, uh, you know, lacked if you like, but what we’ve been finding is that because of the tool kit that comes along with this piece of software is so robust, we’ve actually, you know, leapfrog. What we thought was possible in our whole dispensing process by using this new software.

 

[01:03:57] And maybe I’m still in the honeymoon [01:04:00] phase with this, but I’m really liking it. And I think our team’s really liking it as well, and it’s made us much more efficient and we are able to fulfill our promises a lot better. And also we just know where everything is in our process. So we can follow up a prescription from the start all the way to the end and know exactly where it is in our process, because our software will tell us that, well, I can safely tell you that this must be a really impressive software thing because the honeymoon phase of every single EHR we’ve ever gone to has not been the best part of the switchover.

 

[01:04:36] It’s been a nightmare. Every time we get to the end of the honeymoon phase, people were saying, okay, now that we know this, you are never changing our software again. Right. You know? So, uh, that’s uh, that’s the kind of, when you said, oh gosh, I just have. Uh, Colette, uh, looking at me at the office going, no, we’re not changing again.

 

[01:04:54] We’ve done this. No, we’re not doing it again, but that was quarter two, [01:05:00] quarter three was really good, but then we started figuring this out. It’s not as bad as in five. It’s going to be. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I really appreciate the time you guys have given me today. Um, and um, I really, I can’t wait to see you guys live in the flesh again, hopefully sometime before our third year’s over with.

 

[01:05:19] Um, but thank you very much for both being here. Thanks for having us, Ted. This is a real pleasure in a purse. It’s really nice to see you and talk with you. We’ve missed you as well. Yeah, I wasn’t sure. I wasn’t sure what we’re going to get it. And we were getting ourselves into here, but this has been a really good, uh, good.

 

[01:05:38] Good. knowing who your customer is.

 

[01:05:55] So now, Catherine, you’ve been through this, you said you were thinking [01:06:00] about doing one of these. You should do this now. Hm, I totally should. I know Darryl’s been bugging me to get, to get going with it. So I. I, I feel like we could probably pull together something that would be of interest to people. And I think that I have to figure out is our audience.

 

[01:06:19] I’ve been trying to get her in front of the camera. Um, because Adam I’m a marketing guy says video sells and he’s, he said nothing but success with doing video on digital marketing. So, but yeah, uh, it’s really, the hardest part for me has been, and this is going to come as no surprise to y’all at all. Um, to ask a question and then shut up and just let y’all talk.

 

[01:06:44] It is excruciatingly painful for me sometimes with these, because I just want to say something so bad and I can’t, you know, Because you’re the guest, you’re the ones that are the star of the show with this one. I’m just the, you know, asking the questions. But, uh, it has [01:07:00] been, it’s really helped me out a lot though.

 

[01:07:02] Uh, and my regular life, because now I’m not talking as much as I used to. I’m listening a lot more. And so this has been, not that you can tell right now by what I’m doing, but you know, it, it has made me a much better listener, a much better listener and zoom has done for me. Like if you start interrupting people do you’re on a zoom call or this, all these multimedia, um, comp meetings, you end up interrupting everybody and nobody gets anything done.

 

[01:07:30] And you know, it’s like, you don’t get the message. So that’s what I find with this zoom and platforms. And you have to pause, wait from the finished talking, then make sure they’re done talking, then you can start talking. Right. So that’s what I find the listening part of it too.